bought a Montgomery 17

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Art Haberland
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by Art Haberland »

well, now that teais home, it is time to go over the good, the bad, and the ugly. Overall, I could drop this 25 year old Monty in the water today and go sailing -if the DMV was not closed due to the virus and not due to reopen until march 30. She is in just that good of shape.

Like everything else though, it is the small things that can make or break a love affair with a boat. While I will wait a year to make big changes such as opening ports and paint, there is much I can do now to make tea into a much more enjoyable boat.

While not seen on any of these pictures, she actually comes with a very nice upgrade in the form of a "high performance kick up rudder assembly" from Rudder Craft. While not as pretty as the original Monty Rudder, this promises better balanced "feel" and appears to be smoother in operation in raising or lowering. It certainly is heavy.

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As we are at the rudder, I need to point out that my Monty no longer has her stock engine mount, but instead has one that can be raised or lowered. Unfortunately this has led to some serious gelcoat cracks along the hull to deck mount area. I am going to have to grind out this whole area and repair it. I might update to a better removable engine mount.

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She also has a small hole in the middle of the top of her stern. Not sure what it was put in for, but it was not done on accident. Again, something to be repaired later.

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I will also admit to hating the boarding ladder. I will be doing something about that, just not sure what yet. Between the Rudder, boarding ladder, and engine, tea's stern is extremely cluttered and that annoys me to no end. What is the sense of owning a pretty boat if you are going to hang shit all over it?

And of course there is this lonely little stern light. The previous owner had ripped out all the wiring and lighting off of my boat, but left this poor thing to hang on the stern and do nothing. I will be rewiring and adding navigation, anchor, and steaming lights back to tea, but I will be upgrading this poor light to something more modern and LED.

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And to round off the stern: There are several outlets and mounts in the cockpit that need to be addressed. I am not planning on powering anything up back here, so all this will have to go and get cleaned up.

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Moving forwards, the dropboards are made of what looks like starboard, and while functional and rot proof, not very exciting or pretty. I have a sheet of Sapale in the basement, so I will be building something more classy here. The bottom board I am going to keep though. As I am not fond of the small step over lip that separates the cockpit from the cabin, I will keep it in place while sailing and add a compass, radio, and airhorn mount to it so they fall more easily to hand when out and about on the water.

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Inside the cabin looks decent enough at first glance. Plain but functional with some non-grotty velvet green cushions on the v-berth but not on the quarters. These will be going away, but it is not a pressing need as they are still quite functional at the moment.

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The problem is when you look down. That big gray panel is where tea had all her electrical switches and controls. This is going to be a big repair that will make a distinct change in how the cabin looks. As I will be adding electrics and electronics back to my Monty, I will need to add switches back along with power points, and such. Watch this space.

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No surprises in the storage areas of the cabin. Battery on the Port side, portapottie on the SB. Under the cushions is in really good shape and the lift off panels look almost new.

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battery storage. I may put an almost new AGM battery here and move it further forwards out of the way.

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Portapottie. I shudder to think of the horrors that lie within. I am not a fan of this kind of toilet, so I will be removing it and doing some surgery to install a c-head composting toilet.

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Looking into the quarter berths and under the cockpit reveals no surprises. I do need to replace the cockpit drain hoses as they look to be at the end of their lives.

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Under the cockpit I want to add some pull out drawers to make storage more accessible and organized. I will be borrowing from the overlanding community to design and build these.

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Looking up is where the cabin space falls apart. tea has obviously had many rigging changes over the years. The underside of the cabin top is a minefield of bolts that are just waiting to scalp the balding. Some of them are only there to fill holes from equipment that was removed, others were added haphazardly as pulleys, cam cleats, and handrails were added, removed, moved, and put back. I am thinking I will have to do a lot of filling and sealing before adding something decorative to this deadly looking area.

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Moving topside, I only see two things that annoy me. Not a fan of the dark gray anti-skid. The guy I bought tea from painted it and was planning on doing the same to the gunwale strip along her side. I am thinking something less harsh to look at and cooler on the feet like a light tan or sand colour.

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And finally, as the previous owner was getting up in years and his older wife was positively elderly, he removed the teak toerails from the aft end of the deck to put in jibsheet guides. This allowed him to control everything from the aft end of the cockpit and not bother his wife with lines or tripping hazards as she moved from side to side with the ever changing heel. I would rather have the toerails as I usually sail alone and tend to sit further forwards.

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Overall though, aside from not being able to register her in my name till the end of the month and the drainage hoses that need to be replaced before she sees water again, I do not see anything keeping me from splashing tea right now and going for a sail. I also have enough small little projects to keep me happily occupied for a while.
lustyslogger
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by lustyslogger »

As has been repeated said B O A T stands for "Bring Out Another Thousand". However, you are starting from a lovely platform.

You should contact Josh Colvin about doing an article of your restoration of this boat.
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wdscobie
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by wdscobie »

Art Haberland wrote:I need to point out that my Monty no longer has her stock engine mount, ... I might update to a better removable engine mount.

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That IS an excellent motor mount! A Garhauer OB-125. The stock mount on all the Sage boats and also on the newer M17 & M15s. I have two guesses on what has happened:

#1 is that the outboard was left on the mount when trailered and this caused excessive stress from bouncing down the road. I don't recommend the outboard remain on the motor mount when trailering. What is the outboard size?

#2 is there is not backing plate. If there isn't one uninstall what you have, repair the old mount's holes and the cracked gel coat above. Keep the holes for the current - overdrill and fill with thickened epoxy and redrill if you take the mount off to install a backing plate.


Question: does the gel coat cracking continue through to the fiberglass? Can you see cracked glass if you crawl down the 1/4-berth and look at the inside of the transom?

Art Haberland wrote:She also has a small hole in the middle of the top of her stern. Not sure what it was put in for, but it was not done on accident. Again, something to be repaired later.

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That hole, and the camcleat on the starboard side, are for the original, superior, solid mahagony slide up/down rudder. A line was 8-knoted at the hole (knot on top and the line threaded through the hole) then lead down through a hole in the rudder and up to the camcleat. An simple and better functioning system than RudderCraft's. I don't believe the clamcleat is original as Jerry usually installed an actual cleat, like the stern cleats & centerboard pennant cleat, on the transom - you don't picture the transom where the cleat would have been installed but look for a couple of old holes ... or is there are cleat present?

the hole is through solid glass. no reason to fill besides aesthetics.

Art Haberland wrote:I will also admit to hating the boarding ladder.
That ladder is important for safety! How can you get back aboard if you go into the drink? I encourage you to try and re-board the boat without using the ladder before removing it!!

You need to rethink the line running through the transom camcleat - can you when tired, cold and scared release that line so the ladder deploys?

Art Haberland wrote:And of course there is this lonely little stern light. ... I will be upgrading this poor light to something more modern and LED.

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That looks like a good Aqua Signal fixture (maybe needs a new lens). Nothing the matter with it now in that location. Don't install a light closer inboard as the rudder will block visibility. IMO get a LED bulb for the current fixture and save a few $100s for other projects.

Art Haberland wrote:And to round off the stern: There are several outlets and mounts in the cockpit that need to be addressed.

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The upper item is for mounting an autopilot - likely a Raymarine ST1000.
The aft port is the power connector (and data sharing network if installed) for the Raymarine. IMO if they are not leaking just leave them and save the effort and $$ for other tasks.

Art Haberland wrote:As I am not fond of the small step over lip that separates the cockpit from the cabin, I will keep it in place while sailing and add a compass, radio, and airhorn mount to it so they fall more easily to hand when out and about on the water.
I always kept the lower board in place on my M17.

Art Haberland wrote:As I will be adding electrics and electronics back to my Monty, I will need to add switches back along with power points, and such. Watch this space.
what I did -

stock -
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FYI - the screw-in deck hatch is for accessing the potti 'flush' lever.

after upgrade -
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I removed the huge battery master switch and put the stainless vent. Behind the vent the battery charger is mounted on the v-berth 1/2-bulkhead - the vent provides cooling for the charger.

More details -

https://m17-375.com/2018/04/10/upgraded ... al-system/

Art Haberland wrote:Portapottie. I shudder to think of the horrors that lie within. I am not a fan of this kind of toilet, so I will be removing it and doing some surgery to install a c-head composting toilet.
You don't have much height to work with under the v-berth. That is a good potti. A Thetford 135? If you decide not to use it DON'T throw it away. It fits the M15 - the new, mid-2012 and newer Thetford 135/260 potties don't. Sell it you use a different system!! Get some boat bucks and one less bit of plastic into a landfill!

Art Haberland wrote:I usually sail alone and tend to sit further forwards.
Sit between the tiller and the cockpit floor traveler. Sitting forward of that makes using the jib sheet clamcleats a challenge as they tail aft of a forward sitting location. (Also sitting forward of the traveler makes handling the tiller a challenge.) The only time I will move forward of the traveler is when off the wind and racing to get the transom out of the water (also raise the centerboard for off-wind to get a bit more speed).

If the boat doesn't have one already get a TillerClutch by WaveFront.


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This modification is one of those things that make me say 'why why WHY!!'. He could have just mounted the eyes onto the existing toe rails!!!


If you get stuck on anything or need explanation of how Jerry rigged & built the boat let me know.
--
:: Dave Scobie
:: Liveaboard: Baba 30 DEJA VU
:: Owner M6'8" dingy
:: Former SWALLOW - https://sailboatswallow.wordpress.com
:: Former M17 SWEET PEA - https://m17-375.com
:: Former M15 SCRED - https://m15namedscred.wordpress.com/
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wdscobie
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by wdscobie »

Art Haberland wrote:Image
Looking to the port side of the companionway slider hatch there are four fasteners in a square pattern. There should be a winch in this location. You WANT ONE! This winch is for tensioning the jib harlyard (just enough tension to get the 'scallops' out of the luff as the wind increases - decrease tension as the wind decreases).

The jib halyard goes from the mast, through the block at the foot of the mast, through the cheek block outboard the mast and then to the winch and clamcleat aft the winch.

Were you lucky enough to the the winch in a box of misc. boat parts?

I don't know why there are two lines going aft on the port side. Topping lift?

On the starboard side cunningham line is good. On my M17 I ran the cunningham and the topping lift aft on the starboard side.

IMO running the main halyard aft really doesn't help as the reefing is done at the mast so the halyard should be at the mast. (This is where a TillerClutch really helps!)

Again, if you have questions let me know.
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:: Dave Scobie
:: Liveaboard: Baba 30 DEJA VU
:: Owner M6'8" dingy
:: Former SWALLOW - https://sailboatswallow.wordpress.com
:: Former M17 SWEET PEA - https://m17-375.com
:: Former M15 SCRED - https://m15namedscred.wordpress.com/
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Art Haberland
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by Art Haberland »

Thanks Dave. This boat is much more complicated than both my SeaSprite and GP14 ever where. You are correct about the topping lift, I need to figure out how one of those works as I have never used one.

The outboard that came with her a 4hp yamaha. I will be selling it as I already own a torqeedo 1003.

As for the rudder, I do not care for the ruddercraft one. I find it offensively ugly compared to the rest of the boat. I would love to find an original M17 one.

I know the boat originally came from Miami, I have the paperwork that states she was in Miami as late as 2012 (when the engine was purchased). And that the owner previous to me bought her 5 years ago and had her trailered up at that time.

Do you know anything about the drain hoses? They look almost like radiator hoses that run from the rear storage compartment to the thruhulls under the stern. I was surprised to see them as I always thought that the monty drained out the stern through that storage area?
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by lustyslogger »

Art
How much will you be asking for the motor? I use a trolling motor now but would like to replace it with a real outboard. New ones cost more than I paid for the boat and that just doesn't seem right to me!!
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Art Haberland
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by Art Haberland »

unfortunately you are a bit far away though?
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by GregWads »

Mis-information deleted.

Sorry about that.
Last edited by GregWads on Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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wdscobie
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by wdscobie »

GregWads wrote:Here are some other ideas for your Monty.
The boat in that video isn't a Montgomery. Jerry Montgomery had nothing to do with it and he has asked that his name not be attached to the boat.
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:: Dave Scobie
:: Liveaboard: Baba 30 DEJA VU
:: Owner M6'8" dingy
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:: Former M17 SWEET PEA - https://m17-375.com
:: Former M15 SCRED - https://m15namedscred.wordpress.com/
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Re: bought a Montgomery 17

Post by GregWads »

Sorry about that. I have edited my post to delete the link.
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